Should Nemo stay in the Seas?

[One Swell Bear]

I don't know if this was asked before,but I would have to say I don't care. The last 5 years the Living Seas was at Epcot there was nothing but an aquarium, a manatee habitat, and a gift shop. Nemo basically brought activity to the attraction, which a pravillion ike The Seas needs!

Plus, kids can learn more about the ocean this way.

[PeoplemoverMatt]

More people is good. Dumbing down the attraction and making it seem like trademarks are the only good reason kids should learn things is bad.

Kids should learn about the ocean for more reasons than because Nemo told them to.

-- PMM

[HMF]

As soon as I become an Imagineer I plan to have Nemo kicked out of the Seas ASAP.

[One Swell Bear]

Originally Posted by PeoplemoverMatt

More people is good. Dumbing down the attraction and making it seem like trademarks are the only good reason kids should learn things is bad.

Kids should learn about the ocean for more reasons than because Nemo told them to.

-- PMM

Yes, I see what you mean. Of course the original Living Seas ride was better.

Come to think of it, I saw a video on youtube of the The Seas with Nemo and Friends ride, and it was kind of dumb.


But as I said I really don't care. I probably won't go back on the attraction anyway. it depends.

[ohtherain]

Nemo! Yay! Nemo = Disney-Pixar overhype. Ever notice that there are so many more Disney-Pixar characters than there are Disney? Toy Story Midway Mania? The Seas with Nemo and Friends? Finding Nemo the Musical? Block Party Bash? Laugh Floor Comedy Club? Those are five recent additions to the Walt Disney World Resort that all have to do with Disney-Pixar. Augh...if Disney was so crazy about Pixar, why not throw them into Fantasyland and the Magic Kingdom parades?

(Obviously, sarcasm)

[Becker7716]

Originally Posted by HMF

As soon as I become an Imagineer I plan to have Nemo kicked out of the Seas ASAP.

If you ever want to give me a HUGE gift , this would be it. I hate what The Seas has become. The new Nemo ride was horrific, Turtle Talk with Crush sat alright with me, but Crush could have been added without throwing in all the other junk. It used to be a classic attraction.

[HMF]

Originally Posted by Becker7716

If you ever want to give me a HUGE gift , this would be it. I hate what The Seas has become. The new Nemo ride was horrific, Turtle Talk with Crush sat alright with me, but Crush could have been added without throwing in all the other junk. It used to be a classic attraction.

I also intend on bringing back the hydrolators. oh and Turtle Talk will still be there. A lttle Nemo would not hurt but having him run the pavilion like he is now is against the spirit of Epcot.

[Legacy]

Originally Posted by ohtherain

Nemo! Yay! Nemo = Disney-Pixar overhype. Ever notice that there are so many more Disney-Pixar characters than there are Disney? Toy Story Midway Mania? The Seas with Nemo and Friends? Finding Nemo the Musical? Block Party Bash? Laugh Floor Comedy Club? Those are five recent additions to the Walt Disney World Resort that all have to do with Disney-Pixar. Augh...if Disney was so crazy about Pixar, why not throw them into Fantasyland and the Magic Kingdom parades?

(Obviously, sarcasm)

Quick question... what Disney animated movies over the past five years have been released that were popular enough to warrant active marketing? How about 10 years?
Since 1998 we have had Hercules, Mulan, Tarzan, Emp's New Groove, Atlantis, Lilo and Stitch, and Treasure Planet. Since 2003, Brother Bear, Home on the Range, Chicken Little and Meet the Robinsons. Nemo is the only animated film Disney has rights to that is in the top 100 highest grossing films (after inflation). The only other "recent" animated film on the list is Lion King, and that's 15 years old.

Disney has to use what is popular. Pixar is more popular than Disney films right now. Hopefully that will change with (The Frog Princess). But until then... Pixar is the animated money maker.

Originally Posted by PeoplemoverMatt

More people is good. Dumbing down the attraction and making it seem like trademarks are the only good reason kids should learn things is bad.

Kids should learn about the ocean for more reasons than because Nemo told them to.

-- PMM

This is getting into a different argument, but a clownfish is about the only way education can be entertaining to children nowadays.

Originally Posted by HMF

I also intend on bringing back the hydrolators. oh and Turtle Talk will still be there. A lttle Nemo would not hurt but having him run the pavilion like he is now is against the spirit of Epcot.

I disagree that the fish is against the spirit of Epcot. Epcot is meant to inspire, and The Seas with Nemo and Friends do that much better than "The Deluge" film, an aquarium, and a shaking floor. It's a different generation of audience now. The shift simply reflects that.

[tomserwin]

Originally Posted by HMF

As soon as I become an Imagineer I plan to have Nemo kicked out of the Seas ASAP.

Yes, let me know how that goes..

[PeoplemoverMatt]

Originally Posted by Legacy

Disney has to use what is popular. Pixar is more popular than Disney films right now. Hopefully that will change with (The Frog Princess). But until then... Pixar is the animated money maker.

This is getting into a different argument, but a clownfish is about the only way education can be entertaining to children nowadays.

I think that's a little too fatalistic an outlook to have. Children can be easily entertained by simply coming up with a clever way to both educate and entertain. The Nemo trademarks are not required, but they are easier to use than going through the creative process for an entertaining story just for one attraction. I mean, who would go through all that trouble? Oh yeah, Disney would, or at least did some years ago.

Originally Posted by Legacy

I disagree that the fish is against the spirit of Epcot. Epcot is meant to inspire, and The Seas with Nemo and Friends do that much better than "The Deluge" film, an aquarium, and a shaking floor. It's a different generation of audience now. The shift simply reflects that.

The shift does reflect that The Living Seas needed a boost. I don't think anyone would have argued that. However, was Nemo required? Was Nemo the ONLY way to do that? No. Nemo was simply the easiest way to do that. And then when they hear they could use the same new Nemo animation made for the new attraction for another new attraction at Disneyland across the USA, well you've got the perfect low-cost high-return cheap way to boost a fledgling attraction.

Nemo works...for now. But will Nemo be so attractive even 5 years from now? Hardly. That's always the problem with using dated movie trademarks. They have no lasting power. Once that time is over, The Seas w/ Nemo will be in the same place The Living Seas was. Well, except for the 'Living' part...

-- PMM

[One Swell Bear]

Originally Posted by PeoplemoverMatt

Nemo works...for now. But will Nemo be so attractive even 5 years from now? Hardly. That's always the problem with using dated movie trademarks. They have no lasting power. Once that time is over, The Seas w/ Nemo will be in the same place The Living Seas was. Well, except for the 'Living' part...

-- PMM

VERY True. I don't think Nemo will last 20 years like The Living Seas did!


Also, I just though of this right now: Nemo brings people to the attraction (which it sorely needed), but just because it mixes a Disney film with real life knowledge doesn't demean the purpose of Epcot, it just helps it. If I recall, Epcot's purpose was to educate for a future generation. Today's generation is different, but whether you like it or not, people are learning from Nemo by relating it to real ocean life, which is the reason it works at Epcot.What's wrong with that?

Do i miss the old living seas? Duh! Do I care if Nemo stays? ......No.....not really. At least it brings in an audience and educates.......................

[Foolish Mortal]

I knew I'd see people say putting Nemo in dumbs down the attraction! Nemo saved the attraction! Sure the ride was better long ago, but does anyone remember what the attraction was like before Nemo was put in? Over the years, many things such as the ride were being taken out of the attraction. Pretty soon, the Living Seas became a hydrilator to an aquarium with a gift shop. Why would people want to check out an aquarium when there are rides to see all over the park?!? Living seas was an awesome attraction, but It became gutted and some of the neat things about it were taken out. With Nemo at the Living Seas, the attraction became a little more interesting again.

[Foolish Mortal]

Originally Posted by PeoplemoverMatt

Nemo works...for now. But will Nemo be so attractive even 5 years from now? Hardly. That's always the problem with using dated movie trademarks. They have no lasting power. Once that time is over, The Seas w/ Nemo will be in the same place The Living Seas was. Well, except for the 'Living' part...

-- PMM

Nemo wont become dated. Many Disney films like Aladdin, Beauty and the Beast, The Lion King, Snow White, Peter Pan, Alice in Wonderland, The Jungle Book and others may be old, but they aren't dated. They became classics over the years because many like them- just like Finding Nemo. It may be pixar taking over a once great attraction, but Nemo could stay awhile. Many "dated" Disney rides based on movies are still "attractive" at the parks like Peter Pan's Flight, Alice in Wonderland, Splash Mountain (based on Song of the South), and others.

[PeoplemoverMatt]

Originally Posted by Foolish Mortal

Nemo wont become dated. Many Disney films like Aladdin, Beauty and the Beast, The Lion King, Snow White, Peter Pan, Alice in Wonderland, The Jungle Book and others may be old, but they aren't dated. They became classics over the years because many like them- just like Finding Nemo. It may be pixar taking over a once great attraction, but Nemo could stay awhile. Many "dated" Disney rides based on movies are still "attractive" at the parks like Peter Pan's Flight, Alice in Wonderland, Splash Mountain (based on Song of the South), and others.

I didn't say it was necessarily going to die because it has movie trademarks now. My point was movie trademarks only help for so long, then they're drawing power is the same or less than the drawing power the attraction had before the movie trademark came. Case in point - Pirates of the Caribbean. In Disneyland, Pirates today has the exact same wait times now as it did in the years before the changes came. Adding Jack Sparrow helped for a while, but now it's ridership is basically back to what it was. Whether you put Nemo in the upper echelons of Peter Pan, Snow White & the rest is up to your opinion. I wouldn't.

Originally Posted by One Swell Bear

Today's generation is different, but whether you like it or not, people are learning from Nemo by relating it to real ocean life, which is the reason it works at Epcot.What's wrong with that?

There's nothing wrong with that at all. My point there was that the perception is the kids wouldn't care about learning about the ocean unless Nemo was there to entertain them, and there IS something wrong with that IMO.

-- Peoplemover "Trying to educate the most over-entertained generation in human history is not easy!" Matt

[tomserwin]

Originally Posted by PeoplemoverMatt

My point there was that the perception is the kids wouldn't care about learning about the ocean unless Nemo was there to entertain them, and there IS something wrong with that IMO.

-- Peoplemover "Trying to educate the most over-entertained generation in human history is not easy!" Matt

Amen!!!

You have nothing but my greatest respect (and sympathy) for "Trying to educate the most over-entertained generation in human history."

Nemo is entirely unnecessary for education, Epcot, and the Seas. Just because there is a movie about a lost, handicapped fish doesn't mean he needs to be involoved, in any way, with Epcot or the Epcot spirit. There's a whole lot of things to learn about a world that's surface is 75% water. Personally, I have learned a lot about oceanography without the aid of a clown fish.